Cheltenham Group Meeting 4/03/10

[fiona]

We focussed on two papers from the C and Pewsey Groups: Individuality Part I (up to and including the Tolstoy passage) and Part II.

Part I. We began with H.H.’s reference to Play (related to caring for young children), and how two atmans can become one in heart. This led to a discussion on the silent, impartial observer and how ego needs to become the servant, not the master. Ego is necessary, but to take on a conscious role. Perhaps because we were focussing on play, examples were given related to the theatre: how, visiting Stratford over the years, one can see the same Shakespeare play set in different eras and styles – yet the truth of the words is always there. Sometimes a particular, individual production can give fresh emphasis. Someone gave an example of how an overtly political production of The Tempest almost masked the deeper truths of the play. Another, different example was given of seeing a play twice, but on the second occasion, due to an actor’s illness, the rest of the cast, plus a new member, swapped roles. This change gave our group member a slightly confusing and different view of the play, due to the actors’ individual egos and personalities. In regard to the passage from Anna Karenina, we felt Tolstoy was speaking from the heart of his experience. Was this, someone asked, like step 4, the pull of the way? Or, as someone suggested, like the creation of magnetic centre.
Part II. Focussing on consistency: ‘Say what you think and do what you say’. We talked of the social difficulties of this - how we are educated to be polite. Someone gave an example of how he was asked to comment on a piece of music, and how the instinct was to remain silent rather than appear negative. Yet, he felt, one should say what one thinks. Someone suggested that giving an explanation for one’s perceived dislike is the key, while another person suggested compassion can help: seeing the best in people’s achievements. We ended by talking about Jiva-atman, deciding that would be sought from the Society’s Sanskrit scholar.

[Rumpelteazer]

We ended by talking about Jiva-atman, deciding that would be sought from the Society’s Sanskrit scholar.

In the meantime, here are some definitions from the Sanskrit dictionary on Dennis Waite's website:

Jiva - the identification of the Atman with a body and mind; sometimes spoken of as "the embodied Atman." See Atman.

Atman - the Self. Usually used to refer to one's true (individual) nature or consciousness but Advaita tells us that there is no such thing as an 'individual' and that this atman is the same as the universal Consciousness, Brahman. See also jiva.

Param-Atman - usually translated as the "supreme Self" as opposed to the Atman in the embodied state, the jivAtman. Swami Dayananda insists that it actually means "limitless" in the sense of not limited by time or place and therefore changeless. See Atman.